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Forum » SpaceEngine » Feedback and Suggestions » Alien life Generators (please read) (What the future of alien life can be)
Alien life Generators (please read)
Tac1017Date: Thursday, 21.08.2014, 21:00 | Message # 1
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I was thinking of this as I was studying my homeworld in the game. When I saw the life, it honestly was very unrealistic; life looks like an absurdly large patch of moss on the land, and nothing at all in the sea or on gas giants! So, I thought of a way this can be solved. I imagined that there was this generator that generated the basic traits (Average location on globe and on food chain, size, lifespan, migration habits, Intelligence, etc.) of different animals on earth (Mammals (sea and land, Reptiles, Amphibians, Birds, Fish, etc.), and altered them to fit the new planet! Here is an example of a profile for a humanoid creature on a procedural planet with explanations at the side (red includes the normal text, while blue includes the things to note):

Species name: A "A" is the unaffected name of the species. Names are in alphabetical order. If there are more than 26 species, two letters will be used (Z,AA,AB,AC,AD,AE...). Viruses will also be included, as organisms that don't share every trait of an actual form of life, and will be cataloged with a double dagger symbol next to their name (eg. X‡)

Intelligence Grade: *SI indicates super intelligence, like humans ( as a note, *I indicates basic intelligence, like fish and arachnids, and *HI indicates Hyper-intelligence, intelligence much higher than that of humans. An intelligence score of B stands for basic life, or life that has no significant intelligence (eg. Plants, Funghi, Protozoa, Bacteria, etc.)

Type: Humanoid this indicates that this species is similar to a human (even though you may say this is too specific, it actually stands for a creature that has a set of arms and a set of legs)

Average Height: 2.7m Average heights will be measured in meters

Average Lifespan: 720 years Average lifespans will be measured in earth years

Average population: 17,00,000,00 Average populations will be rounded to a reasonable place.

This is my idea proposal. If it happens, I think it will be put into the game in the next 2-3 years as an update.





The Terra Hunter of the Milky Way!

(By the way, I was born in 2001, NOT 1972 XD)


Edited by Tac1017 - Thursday, 21.08.2014, 21:50
 
WatsisnameDate: Thursday, 21.08.2014, 21:27 | Message # 2
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While we always welcome suggestions, please understand that you should not expect everything to be realistic right now. Space Engine is still very much a work in progress and there are many features which will be revised, updated, or have not even been implemented yet. You can check the TODO list to see what SpaceEngineer's plans are.

Currently, the planet info will display the type of life that the planet was generated with, which is shown as different colored overlays on terrain. So you will not see anything in oceans or atmospheres. In future versions you may expect a great deal more complexity in the visual representation of life.

At any rate, your ideas here are pretty good. My only concerns would be the combination of intelligence with species name -- I think these would be better kept as separate categories. Also, rounding the population to the nearest hundred makes little sense considering there may be populations of vastly different sizes. It would be better to use significant figures. For example, if you use two significant figures, a population of 138,573,972, will display 140 million. A population of 1,873 will display 1,900, and 12 will display 12.

Quote
If it happens, I think it will be put into the game in the next 2-3 years as an update.

Don't guess if/when it will happen. Updates happen when they're ready. smile





 
Tac1017Date: Friday, 22.08.2014, 01:51 | Message # 3
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Quote
At any rate, your ideas here are pretty good. My only concerns would be the combination of intelligence with species name -- I think these would be better kept as separate categories. Also, rounding the population to the nearest hundred makes little sense considering there may be populations of vastly different sizes. It would be better to use significant figures. For example, if you use two significant figures, a population of 138,573,972, will display 140 million. A population of 1,873 will display 1,800, and 12 will display 12.


Smart thinking! I will edit it up right away!

Added (22.08.2014, 00:51)
---------------------------------------------
What does everyone think? I worked hard on making this recomondation!




The Terra Hunter of the Milky Way!

(By the way, I was born in 2001, NOT 1972 XD)
 
spacerDate: Friday, 22.08.2014, 03:11 | Message # 4
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Tac1017, this will be great to see in the game. but i dont think its will be in the near future.
wink





"we began as wanderers, and we are wanderers still"
-carl sagan

-space engine photographer
 
TenebristhedarkenedDate: Tuesday, 30.09.2014, 03:12 | Message # 5
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Why do all aliens have to be humanoid in the first place? If anything, its unrealistic to expect that all aliens will look like us. Though considering the vastness of space engine, humanoids could still be implemented.

We should also probably apply this system to Earth.

And also, you do realize that Earth alone there are probably 8.7 million species, if not more. Alien planets should have way more than probably say, 26 species.

Maybe I should write some classifications for bodyplans:

Bodyplans based on number of limbs and gait:

Limbless: Beings similar to snakes, or slugs. They have no limbs what so ever.

Monoped: A being with one limb.

Biped: A being with two limbs, differs from a humanoid or a humanesque in that it only has two limbs.

Tripod: A being with three limbs.

Quadruped: A being with four limbs, differs from a humanoid or a humanesque in that it dosen't have a human like body plan.

Humanoid: A being with 2 arms, and 2 legs, and has a bipedal gait. An example would be a Prawn from District 9

Humanesque: A being similar to a humanoid, but, resembles humans alot more. An example would be the Vulcans from Star Trek.

Pentapod: A being with 5 limbs.

Hexapod: A being with 6 limbs.

Heptapod: A being with 7 limbs.

Octopod: A being with 8 limbs.

Novempod: A being with 9 limbs.

Decapod: A being with 10 limbs.

Miscellaneous: Body plans with more than 10 limbs.

Body plans based on symmetry:

Radial symmetry: Animals with a symmetry around a central axis, such as a starfish. There are several variants of this, such as tri-radial symmetry, found in the extinct phylum Trilobozoa.

Bilateral Symmetry: Animals whom if divided along their sagittal plane, will create near identical halves. Most vertebrates on Earth have this symmetry.

Spherical symmetry: Animals, whom, if divided by any cut through the animals center, will create two perfect halves. An example would be Volvox algae.

Biradial symmetry: A combination of bilateral and radial symmetry. The body components are arranged with similar parts on a central axis, and each of the four sides is identical to the opposite side, but, different from the adjacent side. An example would be a Ctenophore.

Asymmetry: No symmetry what so ever. An example would be a sponge.


Edited by Tenebristhedarkened - Wednesday, 01.10.2014, 02:33
 
WatsisnameDate: Tuesday, 30.09.2014, 05:09 | Message # 6
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Quote Tenebristhedarkened ()
Why do all aliens have to be humanoid in the first place?


Who says they are? This is a product of old sci-fi film days, where limited visual FX meant aliens were often depicted by humans in suits. Almost nobody these days expects aliens to always look like us. Even most film and novels are very creative with depicting aliens. Try Blindsight for a stunning example. [Warning: Bad language, mature content, and possibly unpalatable truths.]

Having a huge number of species on a planet is great for realism, but terrible for data storage. How big would planet files have to be if each one has a unique ecosystem of millions of species? wacko

Your listing of relative commonality of different limb-numbered organisms might be too far in the vein of 20th century thinking of correlation between environment and anatomy. Just look at some of the extinct fossil forms of life on Earth for examples which put it to the test. E.g. the Ediacaran fauna. They are totally alien. smile I don't think it is even remotely safe to say that something like the planet's gravitational field strength will have much efficacy in determining how many limbs its creatures will have. Evolution isn't so simple or deterministic. It tries out many new things, continuously. Different body plans, different survival strategies. Some work, some don't, and there's no select path or final destination. On any given planet at any given moment in time, you may find creatures that totally defy whatever expectations we had. Examination of life history on Earth does that to us all the time.





 
TenebristhedarkenedDate: Tuesday, 30.09.2014, 20:11 | Message # 7
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Quote Watsisname ()
Who says they are? This is a product of old sci-fi film days, where limited visual FX meant aliens were often depicted by humans in suits. Almost nobody these days expects aliens to always look like us. Even most film and novels are very creative with depicting aliens. Try Blindsight for a stunning example. [Warning: Bad language, mature content, and possibly unpalatable truths.]

Having a huge number of species on a planet is great for realism, but terrible for data storage. How big would planet files have to be if each one has a unique ecosystem of millions of species?

Your listing of relative commonality of different limb-numbered organisms might be too far in the vein of 20th century thinking of correlation between environment and anatomy. Just look at some of the extinct fossil forms of life on Earth for examples which put it to the test. E.g. the Ediacaran fauna. They are totally alien. I don't think it is even remotely safe to say that something like the planet's gravitational field strength will have much efficacy in determining how many limbs its creatures will have. Evolution isn't so simple or deterministic. It tries out many new things, continuously. Different body plans, different survival strategies. Some work, some don't, and there's no select path or final destination. On any given planet at any given moment in time, you may find creatures that totally defy whatever expectations we had. Examination of life history on Earth does that to us all the time.


I had a few ideas for body plans not based on the number of limbs.

And on a side note, I am sure the number of limbs might be somewhat be based on the gravity, along with other factors, such as windspeed. A tall humanoid on a very windy planet would get knocked down.

And what could be the maximum number of species per planet then?

And finally, what of animals that are unlike anything on earth, such as photosynthetic animals (not counting elysia slugs)? Would be capable of getting some stuff like this in the future?

Could we also get an option to search for planets based on characteristics of life that exists on the planet? It could be something such as organic or exotic chemistry, or the number of limbs they have.

Also, I shall create a better profile for creatures.

Here is an example of an alien created with the quirkiness of space engine

Name of species: Un-named Novempedol Aquatic Sophont

Body plan: Radial symmetry with 9 limbs, all of which can be used as manipulators.

Average IQ: 90

Fossil record: 3.1 mya - present

Habitat: Most bodies of water worldwide

Lifespan: 70 years

Reproduction habits: Hermaphroditic reproduction

Respiration: Gill like structures, as well as a lung for harsh environments.

Blood composition: Coboglobin

Diet: Omnivorous mixotroph

Bodily chemistry: Organic

Population: 70 million individuals

Height: 1.6 meters

Length: 3.5 meters


Edited by Tenebristhedarkened - Wednesday, 01.10.2014, 03:07
 
Tac1017Date: Sunday, 05.10.2014, 00:20 | Message # 8
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Quote Tenebristhedarkened ()
I had a few ideas for body plans not based on the number of limbs.

And on a side note, I am sure the number of limbs might be somewhat be based on the gravity, along with other factors, such as windspeed. A tall humanoid on a very windy planet would get knocked down.

And what could be the maximum number of species per planet then?

And finally, what of animals that are unlike anything on earth, such as photosynthetic animals (not counting elysia slugs)? Would be capable of getting some stuff like this in the future?

Could we also get an option to search for planets based on characteristics of life that exists on the planet? It could be something such as organic or exotic chemistry, or the number of limbs they have.

Also, I shall create a better profile for creatures.

Here is an example of an alien created with the quirkiness of space engine

Name of species: Un-named Novempedol Aquatic Sophont

Body plan: Radial symmetry with 9 limbs, all of which can be used as manipulators.

Average IQ: 90

Fossil record: 3.1 mya - present

Habitat: Most bodies of water worldwide

Lifespan: 70 years

Reproduction habits: Hermaphroditic reproduction

Respiration: Gill like structures, as well as a lung for harsh environments.

Blood composition: Coboglobin

Diet: Omnivorous mixotroph

Bodily chemistry: Organic

Population: 70 million individuals

Height: 1.6 meters

Length: 3.5 meters



WOW! I LOVE THAT IDEA!!!





The Terra Hunter of the Milky Way!

(By the way, I was born in 2001, NOT 1972 XD)
 
giftDate: Friday, 31.10.2014, 23:48 | Message # 9
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When I saw the life, it honestly was very unrealistic; life looks like an absurdly large patch of moss on the land


Man I have the problem too maybe that's a bug to the land completely covered in grass.
 
IdgeliosDate: Monday, 24.11.2014, 08:17 | Message # 10
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Why even have procedural info sheets? I say just let imagination do the job!

I'd say that the current direction in alien generation I can think of is perhaps a quick evolutionary history thingy; like when life first existed on the planet, and depending on how complex the life is give some estimated date on when the shift happened.

Other than that, i'm more interest in visuals that text. When spaceengineer implements the in-game wiki editor I can just say what aliens exist on the planet. Be it radially symmetrical rocky creatures with 8 limbs that have large, leathery hands that can also act as feet or space raptors or killer space insects.
 
lupusDate: Thursday, 27.11.2014, 07:14 | Message # 11
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And who knows if life encountered on a first discovered alien world will be something incomprehensible, say it would be intelligent metallic beings whose form of contact is assimilation of matter. Even carbon-based, apparently Earth-like lifeforms could have a completely alien lifecycle (Orson Scott Card, Speaker for the Dead, anyone?) and thus don't fit in any description.

Don't get me wrong, I don't want to mock others' creativity about alien life. But if we can barely imagine planets orbiting the other suns, based on principles of physics, trying to simulate something utterly more complicated known as life is a little bit... arrogant? And always will be anthropocentric, because aliens like us are the aliens we'd love to see.
Being a fan of such low-tier and nonrealistic franchises like Star Wars I must sound like a hypocritical dick, but it's just what I'm thinking.
 
DoctorOfSpaceDate: Thursday, 27.11.2014, 07:59 | Message # 12
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Quote lupus ()
And always will be anthropocentric, because aliens like us are the aliens we'd love to see.
Being a fan of such low-tier and nonrealistic franchises like Star Wars


This is pretty relevant





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lupusDate: Thursday, 27.11.2014, 08:12 | Message # 13
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Besides, I think that humans are just wrong thinking they will understand any alien civilization. We can't even understand ourselves. smile
 
schwarzwolfDate: Saturday, 29.11.2014, 22:58 | Message # 14
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What i would look forward would be some semi procedural creature generator. Creating Lifeforms with some variations and possible using the variables from the Planet as seed and for generating. So depending on the attributes, it will create large, small, (non)muscular creatures, etc. How much creatures a planet should have is another question. But variations could be generated out of the seed possible aswell. Then the game wouldn't need to store to much of the information.

For the question how the creatures should look and on what materials they should be generated. I heard in some reportages:
"On earth, silicon is one of the most canon materials here and there is even more silicon as carbon. So when there would be silicon based life, earth would be the perfect place for it."
then aswell:
"Evolution would be similar independent where life is from. Limbs, eyes, etc. Everything has gone a large evolution and even without connection has lead to a similar looking. So this seems to be a regularity and would be possible similar on other planets."

Not nessesary in this words, but i think because of this, earth animals and creatures could be the base for alien life form and attributes could be morphed procedurally depending on the data of the planets.
 
HandbananaDate: Sunday, 30.11.2014, 10:33 | Message # 15
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I bet that civilized species will almost always be of humanoid or similar form because of why were able to achieve civilization. Technology requires the manipulation of the environment. Hands are so simple that they may be the most practical tool that a species can evolve to do this with.




Tonight... you.

Edited by Handbanana - Monday, 01.12.2014, 00:45
 
Forum » SpaceEngine » Feedback and Suggestions » Alien life Generators (please read) (What the future of alien life can be)
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