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Forum » SpaceEngine » Feedback and Suggestions » 3D water and clouds
3D water and clouds
matty406Date: Monday, 25.02.2013, 23:19 | Message # 31
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A compromise, which would look a bit nicer than normal while staying away from 3D water, which might not be coming any time soon, would probably be a fine ripple bump/normal map on the water sphere of planets. Currently water is flat as a sheet and some kind of action would make sunsets that bit better.
 
HarbingerDawnDate: Tuesday, 26.02.2013, 00:38 | Message # 32
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I agree. Doing something like what is done in Orbiter so that the specular reflection has some apparent "texture" to it, rather than a smooth spot, would be nice.




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werdnaforeverDate: Tuesday, 26.02.2013, 04:24 | Message # 33
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Quote (HarbingerDawn)
what is done in Orbiter so that the specular reflection has some apparent "texture" to it, rather than a smooth spot

This would help from space, but up close- as in orbiter- it's still very flat. I'd suggest a procedural water texture for looking at it up close, but this would probably look kind of weird. Perhaps - until some fancier water rendering is implemented- there could be three layers:

1. From space: Orbiter style!

2. From very high up: A faint texture pattern that approximates the following:

3.Up close: a single, animated texture, repeating over and over again; and only one copy is stored in memory; even if the animation is just a few different seamlessly tiled textures, blending the first to the second, and then the second to the third, etc.
 
HarbingerDawnDate: Tuesday, 26.02.2013, 04:36 | Message # 34
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I don't think that an animated texture could be implemented without significant work. And if you're going to invest significant time and effort into the water then you should just do it all the way and make it truly fancy 3D water.

Orbiter style seems like the best way to improve it without involving many weeks or months of effort. It doesn't matter much if it's flat, as long as it's not smooth (meaning a smooth reflection). And keep in mind, some worlds will have flat or nearly flat seas, like Titan. A little texture gives the illusion of an active and varied surface well enough. Height is not always necessary. And animations can sometimes look worse than the original static presentation. All else being equal, keep it simple.





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Edited by HarbingerDawn - Tuesday, 26.02.2013, 04:37
 
Jabberwockxeno6109Date: Thursday, 02.05.2013, 16:40 | Message # 35
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Couldn't SE just add a tiled, perhaps animated, bump map?

Edited by Jabberwockxeno6109 - Thursday, 02.05.2013, 16:41
 
HarbingerDawnDate: Thursday, 02.05.2013, 16:53 | Message # 36
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Quote (Jabberwockxeno6109)
Couldn't SE just add a tiled, perhaps animated, bump map?

To the water? For issues with animation, see my post above. As for the bump map, an ocean with swells that don't move looks even less real than a flat ocean, though it could possibly look ok if the layer rotated, but then the features would move at different rates at different latitudes and would look weird.





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Jabberwockxeno6109Date: Thursday, 02.05.2013, 16:58 | Message # 37
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Quote (HarbingerDawn)
For issues with animation, see my post above.

Well, I don't know how difficult it would be for SE, but I know in max, animating a texture is simple.
And I would disagree on flat being better than a nonmoving bump map. Sure it would look odd, but it does now, too. tongue
 
Red_RiverDate: Saturday, 04.05.2013, 01:35 | Message # 38
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would it be possible to generate clouds similar in quality as seen over Earth?
speaking of Earth, I don't see well defined continents on any other earthlike worlds...





 
SalvoDate: Saturday, 04.05.2013, 13:47 | Message # 39
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Quote (Red_River)
speaking of Earth, I don't see well defined continents on any other earthlike worlds...


I found many of them



For example this have 5 main continents with a big ocean and many little islands...

Attachments: 9699229.jpg(158Kb)





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VoekoevakaDate: Saturday, 04.05.2013, 14:05 | Message # 40
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The problem is not the generation of continents, but the erision of coast lines. There are more well defined and eroded coast lines in earth than in Space Engine procedural planets.
And sometimes, I find some landsapes made of small isles . I think these need to be more rare.





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smjjamesDate: Saturday, 04.05.2013, 14:42 | Message # 41
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I wonder how easy it would be to implement a simple erosion proccess? It doesn't neccesarily have to be some kind of complex proccess, just use a fractial procedural thing and have it randomly erode n for x number of times (yes I know that is actually an oversimplication).






Edited by smjjames - Saturday, 04.05.2013, 15:35
 
werdnaforeverDate: Tuesday, 18.06.2013, 05:42 | Message # 42
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If anyone's seen the latest versions of Gogle earth with the atmosphere effects, the newer water surface actually looks really good. I think they are using an animated texture (with an animated specular map), except it's a higher resolution than it used to be. I know animated textures have been talked about a bit, and that it may take lots of work to implement them, but maybe Google's method could provide some more insight?
 
Crashman1390Date: Tuesday, 18.06.2013, 17:49 | Message # 43
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Quote (AlessiaCristallooo)
I dream to see this someday on se :3

Is that OutTerra: Anitworld I smell?





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AiioFluxDate: Saturday, 01.02.2014, 19:36 | Message # 44
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I imagine that volumetric clouds and dynamic water / sea are going to take an awful lot of work to get implemented into SE but when eventually they do, it's going to be so incredibly mindblowing and beautiful that we'll never need to see anything good or nice ever again.

I see some people have been referring to Outerra, I came across this guy who looks to have a different approach, the water is just incredible, particularly the transparency when he looks down at the underwater land, I really hope we will one day get this in SE and I think the idea of some planets having huge waves like skyscrapers would also be incredible and probably feasibly realistic out there in the real universe.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUSdSjnDB_E
 
Destructor1701Date: Thursday, 06.02.2014, 14:42 | Message # 45
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I was having a think about the pseudo rivers while being driven on a long journey. I thought of something that Space Engineer has probably thought of, for how to implement realistic rivers in what seems to me to be a reasonably straightforward way. I got out a notepad and jotted down some thoughts.

I used to do game development in college, but I wasn't cut out for the physics maths or intense data structures, but I got a good way into programming.

That said, it's been at least 4 years since I wrote any significant amount of code, so I'm beyond rusty, but I think I have retained a feel for how a system runs through code, and what ought to be possible, and relatively inexpensive to process.

I'm neither an expert in programming, nor computer logic, nor fluid dynamics, so I'm on shaky foundations, I concede that. Apologies if this is an idiotic approach. I'm posting it here because I couldn't find an exclusive "rivers" thread, and I'm not sure it deserves a thread of its own (though mods, feel free to move it to one).

The idea is roughly this (warning, long-winded):







Edited by Destructor1701 - Thursday, 06.02.2014, 14:43
 
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