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Forum » SpaceEngine » Science and Astronomy Discussions » Unmanned Spaceflight Thread (Discuss unmanned spaceflight topics)
Unmanned Spaceflight Thread
AerospacefagDate: Saturday, 14.09.2013, 16:58 | Message # 16
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On the other hand, there's no need to complain about something wrong in this message, what we really need is just wait for another message of that kind.



Quote (HarbingerDawn)
Before writing anything else, can you please clearly answer this one question: is it not acceptable for multiple valid definitions to exist for the boundary of a star system?

Not exactly. In that case it's better to refer to those boundaries' definition, and not solar system itself, because most people believe that solar system ends where the Pluto is hangin' around, ... erm.. I mean, where we can draw an imaginary line on its circular path in relation to the Sun, which is called "orbit".
 
WatsisnameDate: Saturday, 14.09.2013, 20:38 | Message # 17
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So I have a few questions that, hopefully, will help improve people's understanding of one another:

1: Is the term 'interstellar space' meaningful? If so, how is it defined?
2: Is the boundary of a star system the same as the boundary between a star system and interstellar space?
3: (A restatement of Harb's question) - can there be more than one functional definition of a boundary to a star system?

Quote
AFAIK there are 4 types of forces in the cosmos:
1. Strong Nuclear forces
2. Weak Nuclear Forces
3. Electromagnetic Forces
-------------------------
4. Gravity Forces

The 1st trhee are in the quantum/nano/pico/fempto level and are stronger than the 4th at this level but the 4th, gravity, is stronger in the cosmic astronomical scale.


This is very good reasoning, but I think you may be neglecting the importance of electromagnetism on these scales. smile It is electromagnetism that is responsible for the different conditions between the solar and interstellar environments, and by extension the boundary that the voyager spacecraft has just passed. As Harbinger mentioned earlier, by this metric the spacecraft has entered interstellar space.

Gravity, on the other hand, means very little in the space between stars. Sure, it matters when you look at the orbits of stars in the galaxy, wherein you are considering the gravitational field of all the matter (and dark matter!) within the orbit, but the gravitational force between individual stars is not very important when considering the properties of the interstellar environment.





 
NovaSiliskoDate: Monday, 16.09.2013, 03:23 | Message # 18
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how about we all just shut the hell up
 
Crashman1390Date: Monday, 16.09.2013, 03:28 | Message # 19
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Well this just got awkward...




[b]I was wrong, this forum still has a horrible community.[/b]
 
WatsisnameDate: Monday, 16.09.2013, 04:15 | Message # 20
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Nobody's forcing you to say anything or even to pay any attention to the conversation at all. So you can kindly either contribute something to the thread or keep out of it.




 
HarbingerDawnDate: Monday, 16.09.2013, 04:49 | Message # 21
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Quote (NovaSilisko)
how about we all just shut the hell up

I'm sorry if any of this has upset you. As Watsisname said, please feel free to ignore this thread for the duration of this discussion.

Quote (Crashman1390)
Well this just got awkward...

Two things:

1) No.
2) That was a totally useless and unnecessary post that did not contribute anything in any way.



Getting back on topic... since no one else seems to have anything to say about the topic at hand then we should conclude this discussion.

Summary: Voyager 1 has left the heliosphere and entered interstellar space. It is also still well inside the outer region of the Solar system. This marks an historic occasion because it represents humanity's first probe into the space that exists between the stars. Voyager 2, which is far better equipped to study the interstellar medium, will likely also enter it later in this decade.

What We (Should) Have Learned: Read more deeply into things than scanning the headlines. Consider what is actually being talked about rather than what it seems to you, from your brief skim of an article, is being talked about. Recognize that those little numbers underneath a word in a dictionary are there for a reason: a term can have more than one definition, and there is not necessarily a single universally correct one. Context and perspective matter. Many objects in the outer Solar system actually orbit the sun while immersed within the interstellar medium, and can be said to reside simultaneously within both the Solar system and interstellar space. Finally, something historically and scientifically significant has happened and you should appreciate it.

No more talk about Voyager 1 and interstellar space. There are plenty of other fish in the unmanned spaceflight sea to choose from.





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neutronium76Date: Monday, 16.09.2013, 07:14 | Message # 22
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However...


Just a thought..

Attachments: 6065198.jpg(41Kb)





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HarbingerDawnDate: Monday, 16.09.2013, 07:36 | Message # 23
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Quote (neutronium76)
However...

First, in what was is that relevant to what anyone has said? Second, that's an outdated model, we don't think the heliosphere and interstellar boundary look like that anymore.

Third, did you not read it when it was explained about 50 times that being in interstellar space does not mean that it isn't also in the Solar system!?!?

Now, no more on this subject, as I already said this topic is closed.





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neutronium76Date: Monday, 16.09.2013, 09:12 | Message # 24
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Quote (HarbingerDawn)
First, in what was is that relevant to what anyone has said?


In what it was not relevant? And even if it was not relevant specifically to anyone's comment, it was relevant to the subject.

Quote (HarbingerDawn)
Second, that's an outdated model, we don't think the heliosphere and interstellar boundary look like that anymore.


Really? So how do they look now?

Quote (HarbingerDawn)
did you not read it when it was explained about 50 times that being in interstellar space does not mean that it isn't also in the Solar system!?!?


Yes I did. But it was clearly stated that voyager had left the solar system and entered interstellar space. Did you not read it here ?





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HarbingerDawnDate: Monday, 16.09.2013, 10:05 | Message # 25
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neutronium76, I applaud your diligence in keeping the forum organized by trying to move this increasingly off-topic discussion to a new thread. But I should have been more explicit before (I wasn't thinking about it at the time, and I'm sorry), there should be no more discussion on this subject at all anywhere on the forum for a while. It's grown too contentious and not everyone seems able to be objective and considerate of others' points, so I think we should all take a break and talk about other things.

So this subject is closed for further discussion until October. If anyone here makes another post about it before at time then they'll take a short break from the forum. I don't mean to be mean, I just think that this issue is a little to hot right now and everyone needs to cool down.

So let's move on, there are plenty of other interesting topics in the realm of unmanned spaceflight smile





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Edited by HarbingerDawn - Monday, 16.09.2013, 10:05
 
NovaSiliskoDate: Monday, 16.09.2013, 10:08 | Message # 26
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So... let's change the subject.

Cancelled spacecraft! Lots of things have gone on the chopping block over the years, for one reason or another. For example, JIMO:



Nuclear-powered 50+ meter behemoth that would've gone to Jupiter. In the end, it probably is best it didn't - launches (three of them!) weren't expected before 2017, and the cost of the thing probably would've shot past 10 billion without looking back...
 
midtskogenDate: Monday, 16.09.2013, 10:08 | Message # 27
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Deep Impact mission has ended




NIL DIFFICILE VOLENTI


Edited by midtskogen - Saturday, 21.09.2013, 10:24
 
HarbingerDawnDate: Saturday, 21.09.2013, 11:01 | Message # 28
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midtskogen, I moved your post here.

It is very sad that it "died", there was still much more that it could have accomplished. Still, its achievements should be celebrated. Both its primary and extended missions were great successes smile

Some highlights of Deep Impact's life:









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SalvoDate: Friday, 27.09.2013, 20:05 | Message # 29
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Don't know if fits with the topic, but I find it kinda cool smile
(you can see important moments on description)






The universe is not required to be in perfect harmony with human ambition.

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(still don't know why everyone is doing this...)
 
HarbingerDawnDate: Friday, 27.09.2013, 20:23 | Message # 30
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Quote (Salvo)
Don't know if fits with the topic

Let's think about it: this is a topic about spaceflight, and there is no spaceflight in your video. Ergo, it doesn't fit.





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Forum » SpaceEngine » Science and Astronomy Discussions » Unmanned Spaceflight Thread (Discuss unmanned spaceflight topics)
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