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Forum » SpaceEngine » Gameplay Discussions » Mothership concept
Mothership concept
curiousepicDate: Sunday, 08.01.2012, 02:45 | Message # 31
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I just discovered The Millennial Project 2.0, which has a wealth of future concepts that are extremely well thought-out and integrated with each other, and came across this article and which perfectly describes what I was trying to get across in my earlier posts about the future of spacecraft design, integrating nanotech and "mutating" upgrades, etc.



Here's his vision for interstellar ships, though I think we would get away with a more interesting looking ship like the above for the mothership since we don't actually approach near-light speeds:



More near-future concept, which you should definitely check out if you insist on using this style:






My ideal preferences for visual design of the mothership and technology in SE
Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality


Edited by curiousepic - Sunday, 08.01.2012, 03:31
 
SpaceEngineerDate: Sunday, 08.01.2012, 23:30 | Message # 32
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"Virtually transparent" - is a excellent word for what I want in the pilot cabin / habitation module! It has a solid metallic/composite hull, but paved with hi-res holographic display. Solid hull will protect crew against radiation and meteorites, and 3D/holographic camera/display technology will make transparent windows unnecessary.

*





 
syndromeDate: Tuesday, 10.01.2012, 02:10 | Message # 33
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Thank you for the explanations. The entire concept is looking great.

Edited by syndrome - Tuesday, 10.01.2012, 02:10
 
VelsuvisDate: Tuesday, 10.01.2012, 21:13 | Message # 34
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Most honored greetings fellow cosmofriends biggrin

This will be my very first post, and I must say, after reading all of the posts I have so far... geez, it was hard to find the right post to post in first biggrin

@ syndrome, and for everyone else too, please visit http://pioneerspacesim.net/, as that is a project that is very alive right now, and is the modern re-make of the Elite series, albeit it isn't up to par, it is still a good project for Newtonian spaceflight, as well as a simple galactic economy - with currency and trade.

I have worked with Flavien Brebion for many years... longer and way before the infinity project was named, when I was 14... and my interest in a "Game/flight sim that can 'do-it-all'" was at it's golden age.
My first credit before even finding Flav was with Derek Smart in, to me, his failed Battlecruiser and "Universal Combat" project. (www.3000ad.com)

This too, was around the time that, after a tournament that I had won for a console game, that had begun my REAL career in videogame design and development, it had lifted me to the first height (at the time) to work with Bungie and the first Halo: Combat Evolved. And back at you syndrome, I am unfamiliar with the success you are talking about: "Lately, that concept became even more feasible, and after Notch's major success, it actually became a reality."

Anyhow, sorry for this being my first introduction, as this is being my first post... but on to the topic of a design for the right mothership for a game variant of SE, I would like to make a few propositions.

First, I ask that we not assume anything at this time as for the current stage of technologies that may be employed for SpaceEngine, and I propose, for the beginning purposes to establish the realism in the psudo-form, so that we can at least have a working idea of what may actually work. SpaceEngineer is very right in many respects as to, when this becomes a network based universal simulation... we must keep in mind that not everyone is going to wait for hours or days or months... or the YEARS it takes to simulate what WE know, in our current knowledge of physics, of time/space and laws of motion. For now, I feel it is safe to assume a simple, if even potentially impossible solution for psudo-realistic spaceship based exploration: ie. that we have some form of realism, as I am more than a fan of Orbiter myself (save for their not-so-intuitive approach to the systems and controls with which to use; for those who don't have all the advanced joysticks or flight controls necessary, nor autopilot or other experience to operate a realistically modeled spacecraft.), and I can say that I myself favor and DEMAND for such realism... but I feel that we CAN be creative enough to still ASSUME... as it is the very act of assumption that is a part of our collective intelligence inspired by our imagination that has made the seemingly impossible become not just possible, but even practicable in this day in age.

Going back to Jody Foster in Contact... her argument was Golden, when she expressed her anger at the individuals who were calling her "Need for attempting to contact" and discover other forms of life capable of communication in some form that we may be able to PROVE that "We are not alone"... I will be paraphrasing here, but she said:" I've heard of a couple of guys that wanna build something called an 'airplane'... you get people to go up in it and fly like birds... ridiculous, right? Or what about Rockets to the Moon, or missions to mars, or atomic energy... Science Fiction, right??? All I ask is that you have the tiniest bit of vision..." Darn, I was on all role, but I almost had it all from memory biggrin

Anyhow, point is, REALISM and Dynamism is of absolute importance to me, and I cherish it greatly... but WE make our REALITY... and this includes our technologies that we envision, and end up implementing and employing in our every-day lives. And government and societal "so-called limits" aside too, I feel that any technological or anything we can call a DISCOVERY is self-discovery, no matter how you label it.

In short, I feel that we can take, if SpaceEngineer agrees with my ideal here, a radical approach to the design of the "Mothership" and what innovations and imaginative inspirations we find appropriate to employ... being that the "Sky is the limit"... and well, as SpaceEngineer here has "Engineered for Space ;)" for us here in Space Engine... has proven that the "Sky HAS no Limit!" biggrin

@ curiousepic: I very much appreciate your attention to realism detail... and I hope to further talk to you, Syndrome, SpaceEngineer, and the other few that I have found so far in these forums, that are of great inspiration to me in the time I have come to know of the existence of SE.

I can go on in many technical details myself, but I will save that for future posts after this first posting here. I would like to contribute an idea, in the very spirit of this topic of idealistic propulsion systems, if any of you are familiar with the "Independence War" series... Independence War 1 and 2, in which the drive systems that they had employed was called an "LDS" or Liner Displacement Drive System... and though it had variations of acceleration or Velocity settings... it is idealistic for inter-planetary/inner-system as well as potentially intergalactic transporation... as IDW did use Newtonian physics with a computer for adjustments from human control of direction. Even it it isn't implemented in the final "Game" of SE... I believe that SE is still in the beginning stages of development, and there is ALWAYS a "God Mode" to test the play-space we will be playing in... testing to see where our boundaries need to be, and figuring out a medium balance smile

Primarily, I believe it is assumed that a game variant of SE is aimed at a much larger audience rather than just the average spacesim group... more than just EVE or those who are within the community we support in Infinity Universe and the I-Novae engine... in this case, aimed at a mixture of audiences.... and this may require more than one sim/playset for SE.. but as SE is Space Engine... it is the beginning for, well.. infinity biggrin

Cheers!


Edited by Velsuvis - Tuesday, 10.01.2012, 21:39
 
curiousepicDate: Tuesday, 10.01.2012, 23:58 | Message # 35
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Welcome aboard! Awesome to have another likeminded individual with us, especially another with game dev experience.

BTW, syndrome was referring to the success story of Minecraft. Great video about it here





My ideal preferences for visual design of the mothership and technology in SE
Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality


Edited by curiousepic - Tuesday, 10.01.2012, 23:59
 
SpaceEngineerDate: Wednesday, 11.01.2012, 09:43 | Message # 36
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Hi Velsuvis. You write such a long post, but I do not clearly understand what you are proposing...

*





 
curiousepicDate: Wednesday, 11.01.2012, 15:46 | Message # 37
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Quote (Velsuvis)
if any of you are familiar with the "Independence War" series... Independence War 1 and 2, in which the drive systems that they had employed was called an "LDS" or Liner Displacement Drive System...


SE's concept for hyperflight is somewhat similar to the LDS, except it will conserve inertia relative to the universe, unlike LDS (I think). Be sure to read up about the propsed system here http://en.spaceengine.org/forum/14-369-1





My ideal preferences for visual design of the mothership and technology in SE
Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality
 
curiousepicDate: Monday, 06.02.2012, 19:08 | Message # 38
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Video from the L5 indie series about their ship.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNPhnJFpG3Y





My ideal preferences for visual design of the mothership and technology in SE
Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality
 
AnimusDate: Thursday, 09.02.2012, 16:42 | Message # 39
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Haha, you could make it like Kerbal Space Program where you allow people to construct their own ships if they want biggrin not sure if that's really a viable concept for this kind of engine though, but it's always fun messing around with your spare parts and trying to see if you can stitch something together that doesn't explode on liftoff or has problems navigating. There's a good example of the beta version of the game here http://www.youtube.com/watch?f....BFu9e10 Of course, some of the charm of Kerbal Space Program is that it is ridiculously hard if you're not sure what you're doing, and maybe making it slightly easier to make something that doesn't explode in mid-air would be a good idea. Nonetheless, it's an interesting concept. Maybe you could hide artifacts or enable research of alien technology to further progress in availability of your own parts.
 
VinnyDate: Sunday, 12.02.2012, 03:27 | Message # 40
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Hi, SpaceEngineer!

I'm really looking forward for flying the space ship in spaceengine! Please keep up the excellent work!! Do you know how long it takes before you get finished with the spaceship what you are working on right now? Thanks!

Cheers,
Vincent
 
SpaceEngineerDate: Sunday, 12.02.2012, 14:11 | Message # 41
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I have insidious plan to not include ships in SE until it becomes a full game. However, something may be available in beta test versions.

*





 
VinnyDate: Sunday, 12.02.2012, 17:28 | Message # 42
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Hi, SpaceEngineer!

The spaceengine is not yet in beta, right? I think it sounds like the spaceengine will be in beta pretty soon.

Cheers,
Vincent
 
werdnaforeverDate: Wednesday, 18.04.2012, 09:07 | Message # 43
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I suppose free exploration would still be an option after space ships are integrated, right?

If one indeed chooses to go down the "post-human w/ god like technology with nothing to do but explore the universe" route (or however you describe the kind of entity which could move all over the universe as you currently can do in SE), then having a mothership for this as well would be interesting.

(not sure if this is worthy of a thread of it's own)

I'm thinking of the kind of technology where only a small part exists in this dimension, and the rest in some other kind of dimension, or "hyperspace" (like the really advanced computers in Issac Asimov's "The Last Question"). A highly advanced post human being could reside within. Most of the physical part in our dimension would be living areas and an observation/navigational room. Other areas would be where the ship interacts with it's extra-dimensional systems. The ship could have a simple shape, like a sphere, and could have landing legs to touch down on a surface. (something elegant and simple)

Of course, one could argue that a post human being might not need a physical form; if so you might as well use nothing but a viewpoint (as we currently do in SE)... Now there's no reason why a post-human being couldn't have the same emotions, feelings of awe, curiosity, and desire to explore the universe as we silly humans do. smile After all, who hasn't at one point wanted a spaceship capable of going anywhere in a split second; to be who they are but free from the bounds of society and the limits of current technology?

Overall, I think it would be interesting to have different options for different levels of technology- within reason. You can select your desired level from a menu- the highest being the simple camera, and then lower would be the ship I described, and then lower would be the futuristic concepts curiousepic mentioned before, and then the mothership concept SpaceEngineer is proposing. Each option would have it's own limitations (or lack of limits).
 
werdnaforeverDate: Thursday, 19.04.2012, 04:59 | Message # 44
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Okay- I took a break from my normal SketchUp projects and made something to illustrate my point.





It's basically the vessel I described in my last post. Keep in mind it's not done...

Here is the torus like cabin, with the entrance to the map room and the tunnel to down below.




Right now, you can see I've modeled an exterior and a basic cabin. We are assuming our post human body is still bipedal. (I should note that the models of people are from Google's generic models and are not mine. I did do all the rest.) In the center is a spherical room which will be used for observational and navigational purposes. I've yet to put more in to this area, it needs some more supporting beams or something. (edit- by this I mean places to grab or a seat of some kind so you're not floating all over the place) I've also modeled a hole in the floor of the main cabin- this tunnel leads to a small room below where a ramp would open to the surface of a planet (I haven't modeled the ramp or lower room yet).

Entering the map room. It is spherical to allow for a large, immerse view of the universe around the ship. The sphere would be like a giant monitor.


Inside the map room. I need to add more here.


Here is the tunnel leading up to the main cabin.


If we assume the post human body can cope with zero-g effects easily, then you might as well say the entire cabin would be without gravity. However, the ship should still have fictional artificial gravity technology- this would be used to:

1: Cancel out the effects of gravity from external areas, like huge planets or stars. (We are basically assuming this technology cancels out all external gravitational force, providing only the desired amounts of gravity within)
2: Provide a 1G environment in the main (kind of torus-shaped) cabin area if this would be desirable, and a zero-g environment in areas like the map room and the tunnel.

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Edited by werdnaforever - Thursday, 19.04.2012, 05:00
 
werdnaforeverDate: Thursday, 19.04.2012, 05:29 | Message # 45
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One more thing- regarding propulsion. I suppose I could come up with a technical explanation, but the point is that the ship is as movable as the camera itself- a vessel for free exploration within the engine. Because this ship is science fantasy, if anything it would probably be an optional addon.
 
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